Thu, 5 November 2009 From Wikipedia: DOUBLE DATE | 11.5.09 Jim (John Krasinski) and Pam (Jenna Fischer) are out of excuses so they have no choice but to go out with Michael (Steve Carell) and Helene (Linda Purl), Pam's mother. Meanwhile, Dwight (Rainn Wilson) is strangely doing nice things for everyone in the office. -------- As Kevin mentioned in the last podcast, the "Jim and Pam finally run out of excuses and have to go on a date" thing definitely smacks of DINNER PARTY from season four. Don't get me wrong, I loved THE LOVER, but that was mostly an episode about the CONCEPT of Michael dating Pam's mom. I hope when we get to see the "real thing" that it doesn't get too weird to take. I enjoyed the last few episodes, though, so I am curious to see what they can pull off tonight. As always, leave your thoughts in the comments section below and join Kevin and me in the TWSS Chatroom during and after the show to share your thoughts (click on the green "chat" button in the right sidebar). Category: general -- posted at: 3:02 PM Comments[29] |
If the chat room was any indication, I'm definitely going to be in the minority. Decent episode with some good laughs, but I'm actually pretty disappointed after seeing Pam hit Michael. I understand why Pam would be upset about the situation, but was hitting Michael really necessary? What does that say about her character? I don't mean to sound like a public service announcement about violence, but after all the crazy things Michael's done, was his comment about Helene hitting on him first really that offensive? I understand that it may have been the straw that broke the camel's back, but still. Totally unnecessary.
Throughout the seasons, my favorite character has definitely changed, but never before has a previous "favorite" character become someone I've grown to loathe. And Pam is just driving me crazy. I really miss the Pam from seasons past. I know this isn't going to be a popular statement, but she has been such a poo-head to everyone in the office and I really don't get it. And her hormones and pregnancy are not an excuse for her being nasty and self-righteous.
Perhaps I just need to watch this episode again, but I'm tired of the direction Pam and Jim are going in. Sorry if I seem angry or overly critical, I'm just missing that "every man" perspective that Matt and Kevin refer to. Looking forward to read what everyone else thinks. Maybe I just need to change my own perspective.
Throughout the seasons, my favorite character has definitely changed, but never before has a previous "favorite" character become someone I've grown to loathe. And Pam is just driving me crazy. I really miss the Pam from seasons past. I know this isn't going to be a popular statement, but she has been such a poo-head to everyone in the office and I really don't get it. And her hormones and pregnancy are not an excuse for her being nasty and self-righteous.
Perhaps I just need to watch this episode again, but I'm tired of the direction Pam and Jim are going in. Sorry if I seem angry or overly critical, I'm just missing that "every man" perspective that Matt and Kevin refer to. Looking forward to read what everyone else thinks. Maybe I just need to change my own perspective.
So typical Michael… as soon as Pan accepts that he’s going out with her mommy, he breaks up with her.All I can say is wow…
My favorite part of the episode were:
1. How excited Pan and Jim were about her mommy saying she wanted to be Grandma
2. Dwite trying to get Jim fired
3. (I know this was hardly noticeable but it made me smile) Pan and Jim talking to each other over the menu, in their own little world. I thought it was such a sweat moment!
4. The way Pan, Jim, and her mommy were teasing each other like a real family
I’m still waiting for Pan and Jim to really acknowlege the baby. I mean the thing with Andy last week was funny, but I would prefer Oscar!
My favorite part of the episode were:
1. How excited Pan and Jim were about her mommy saying she wanted to be Grandma
2. Dwite trying to get Jim fired
3. (I know this was hardly noticeable but it made me smile) Pan and Jim talking to each other over the menu, in their own little world. I thought it was such a sweat moment!
4. The way Pan, Jim, and her mommy were teasing each other like a real family
I’m still waiting for Pan and Jim to really acknowlege the baby. I mean the thing with Andy last week was funny, but I would prefer Oscar!
Good episode. I enjoyed seeing "Michael the jerk" for a change instead of "Michael the buffoon." His complete insensitivity and self-centeredness is much more interesting than watching him fall in a koi pond or get yelled at by Pam. I just wish Pam's reaction had been bigger at the table when he dumped her mom (and first tried to pin the blame on Pam!). She should have punched him right then and there.
I enjoyed the Dwight plotline, too. Gotta hand it to the ol' beet farmer -- he's always working an angle. It's becoming pretty clear that he'd have been a far shrewder co-mangager than Jim.
Keep up the great podcast. I'm now making it a habit to go through your site first when buying stuff from Amazon.
I enjoyed the Dwight plotline, too. Gotta hand it to the ol' beet farmer -- he's always working an angle. It's becoming pretty clear that he'd have been a far shrewder co-mangager than Jim.
Keep up the great podcast. I'm now making it a habit to go through your site first when buying stuff from Amazon.
posted by: BrianK on Thu, 11/5 10:37 PM EST
I think this episode was a C. It feels like the writers realized this "mother f***ing" plot wasn't going to last anyway and decided to get rid of Pam's mom quickly.
The secondary plot line was weak. I didn't care too much about it and it wasn't interesting enough to keep my attention. I don't even remember what it was about.
Now, the main plot line. Michael, Michael... Of all the things Michael Gary Scott has done during the running of this show, breaking up with Pam's mom right there and then has got to be the worst. I always considered him to be clueless, insecure of himself and childish but never a bad person at heart. In this episode, however, they showed him as a selfish prick. Poor mom, poor Pam's mom.
And, I have to disagree with Kate. He deserved a hell of a lot more than that slap he got.
The one thing I can't decide is if Pam was sincere when she said she was ok with Michael dating her mom since he was making her happy. For a moment there I felt that she realized that the age difference got to him and was feeding it on purpose.
The secondary plot line was weak. I didn't care too much about it and it wasn't interesting enough to keep my attention. I don't even remember what it was about.
Now, the main plot line. Michael, Michael... Of all the things Michael Gary Scott has done during the running of this show, breaking up with Pam's mom right there and then has got to be the worst. I always considered him to be clueless, insecure of himself and childish but never a bad person at heart. In this episode, however, they showed him as a selfish prick. Poor mom, poor Pam's mom.
And, I have to disagree with Kate. He deserved a hell of a lot more than that slap he got.
The one thing I can't decide is if Pam was sincere when she said she was ok with Michael dating her mom since he was making her happy. For a moment there I felt that she realized that the age difference got to him and was feeding it on purpose.
Yuck. Thought this one was definitely a stinker.
The lunch scene got way way too uncomfortable for my tastes. I really wanted to reach for the remote and change the channel (I didn't). I wish we could have seen some more of the mutually happy dynamic between Michael and Helene before it all came crashing down. This plotline got a little better once they came back to the office. The Ryan and Kelly scene was probably the funniest of the night, with the Toby-Pam scene coming in second. I really didn't like the whole business surrounding the buildup to the punch. I didn't even like it the first time I saw it, when it was "The Duel" last season.
As for the Dwight plotline, I couldn't get over how ridiculous the whole thing was. Even for Dwight plans, this was pretty cartoonish. Even if he expected to be able to call in his favor to get Jim fired, how was having Andy or the rest of the Office in his debt going to be of any use whatsoever? Dwight, I expected better of you after that mallard decoy a scant two weeks ago.
The lunch scene got way way too uncomfortable for my tastes. I really wanted to reach for the remote and change the channel (I didn't). I wish we could have seen some more of the mutually happy dynamic between Michael and Helene before it all came crashing down. This plotline got a little better once they came back to the office. The Ryan and Kelly scene was probably the funniest of the night, with the Toby-Pam scene coming in second. I really didn't like the whole business surrounding the buildup to the punch. I didn't even like it the first time I saw it, when it was "The Duel" last season.
As for the Dwight plotline, I couldn't get over how ridiculous the whole thing was. Even for Dwight plans, this was pretty cartoonish. Even if he expected to be able to call in his favor to get Jim fired, how was having Andy or the rest of the Office in his debt going to be of any use whatsoever? Dwight, I expected better of you after that mallard decoy a scant two weeks ago.
finally we see Jenna Fischer get to act a bit. Pam is angry and looks angry and deserves to be angry. Michael didn't mean to hurt her, but his ignorance and naivete has actually caused suffering. B-plot was kinda weak, but the A-plot was really strong.
The last 8 minutes were phenomenal. That's starting at Pam in Michael's office, "I have the worst attitude of any person here," onwards.
I really, really liked the scene in the parking lot and how the writers put it all together. It felt real. Glad the writers got her to actually hit him in a believable way. Plus this at the end:
"Are you okay?"
"NOOOOOO"
"you're okay."
I really, really liked the scene in the parking lot and how the writers put it all together. It felt real. Glad the writers got her to actually hit him in a believable way. Plus this at the end:
"Are you okay?"
"NOOOOOO"
"you're okay."
Hey guys, thanks for recording a podcast for this episode in a few days... Now you owe me one for thanking you.
posted by: Jayson with a Y on Fri, 11/6 11:03 AM EST
You know when you feel you've had enough of a show like The Office? When you find yourself re-watching Parks and Recreation later that night because it has become so funny it makes you forget everything you saw on The Office.
I'm not going to say I didn't like last night's "Double Date" episode. It was fine, I guess. Michael dating Pam's Mom really icks me out, and "Pammy" was trying to accept the whole thing, even though it appeared as though she was nudging Michael to lose interest in her Mom. I don't know why she had to hit Michael. People are up in arms about that. I don't really care about her motivation anymore. It's all contrived. Comedy no longer flows organically on this show. It's gag after gag. I've been re-watching the syndicated shows on Fox, where seasons 2 and 3 have been shown, and wow...so much has changed since then. I still love THAT show. This one...snores galore.
Also the B story did nothing for me. I love me some Andy - I do, but I'm so tired of Dwight's need to get Jim fired, it's beyond my concern. He's like a buzzing fly around my face - he's so annoying, his revenge is so unimportant and proves to be a waste of time. Although, I would have liked an H&H bagel, thank you very much!
They are running close to empty here, but I'm still going to watch this show until it totally tanks out and needs to be towed off the air.
I'm not going to say I didn't like last night's "Double Date" episode. It was fine, I guess. Michael dating Pam's Mom really icks me out, and "Pammy" was trying to accept the whole thing, even though it appeared as though she was nudging Michael to lose interest in her Mom. I don't know why she had to hit Michael. People are up in arms about that. I don't really care about her motivation anymore. It's all contrived. Comedy no longer flows organically on this show. It's gag after gag. I've been re-watching the syndicated shows on Fox, where seasons 2 and 3 have been shown, and wow...so much has changed since then. I still love THAT show. This one...snores galore.
Also the B story did nothing for me. I love me some Andy - I do, but I'm so tired of Dwight's need to get Jim fired, it's beyond my concern. He's like a buzzing fly around my face - he's so annoying, his revenge is so unimportant and proves to be a waste of time. Although, I would have liked an H&H bagel, thank you very much!
They are running close to empty here, but I'm still going to watch this show until it totally tanks out and needs to be towed off the air.
posted by: Debi on Fri, 11/6 11:54 AM EST
Wow. Surprised at the negativity here. I thought this was the third awesome episode in a row. I loved how it moved at such a fast pace, the squirm-inducing birthday lunch, the constant one-upmanship of Dwight and Andy (like watching Yosemite Sam and Elmer Fudd duke it out over Bugs), Ryan ascending to yet another level of douchiness (check out the website) and Toby giving Pam pointers.
I can understand why people may not like this episode, but I think this was a necessary ep to clear the tension between Pam and Michael. Hopefully this'll lead to more happy Pam that the fans are clamoring for.
I can understand why people may not like this episode, but I think this was a necessary ep to clear the tension between Pam and Michael. Hopefully this'll lead to more happy Pam that the fans are clamoring for.
You ever get the feeling that sitcoms in general are running out of steam, like forever? Maybe the funniest shows are reality TV. I do love me some American Idol and any show featuring the Kardashians. Hilarious, and not even in an ironic way!
posted by: Debi on Fri, 11/6 06:43 PM EST
All those years of Michael telling people to hit him have finally come back to bite him. I thought this episode started off great, from Andy and Dwight's back and forth, to Pam's attempted escape, like "Dinner Party." However, this was a roller coaster for me, going downhill after the "eat your cake, Helene. I want you to enjoy it." What happened to the speech two weeks ago? I was dissapointed in Michael's shallowness, and taking Pam down right when she was coming around. When he was at the bar, I thought we were going to have a Michael-Pam heart to heart talk, but they let me down. But when they got quiet when the waitress cane over, I laughed so hard and thought it was so brilliant and true to life that it got me back up again. Everything else: Kevin being fired, Ryan's weird photography phase, Flenderson's revenge, and Creed's "Thank God" line was hilarious. Solid B from me.
All the talk this season seems to be about the "new pam" I think that for the third episode in a row they portrayed her perfectly, standing up for herself without being to ridiculous and obnoxious.
Oh Michael, I'm glad that him and Pam's mom stuff is over, although I felt so bad for Pam's mother, and Pam was finally warming up to the idea when she saw everything Michael did for Helene.
Also I very much liked the A plot B plot, that as you guys have pointed out, have been in the best (season two) of the office episodes. Dwight was maybe a little cartoonish but there wasn't too much of Dwight/Andy so I thought it was fine.
My only thing (this is not a complaint though) what happened to Jim and the whole "manning up" storyline? And I would really like to see Jim acknowledge the baby a bit more, however for some reason I really loved Jim in this episode!
Overall, I would give it a B+ to A-. Classic office with a new twist. I like it and hope that the season continues this way.
Oh Michael, I'm glad that him and Pam's mom stuff is over, although I felt so bad for Pam's mother, and Pam was finally warming up to the idea when she saw everything Michael did for Helene.
Also I very much liked the A plot B plot, that as you guys have pointed out, have been in the best (season two) of the office episodes. Dwight was maybe a little cartoonish but there wasn't too much of Dwight/Andy so I thought it was fine.
My only thing (this is not a complaint though) what happened to Jim and the whole "manning up" storyline? And I would really like to see Jim acknowledge the baby a bit more, however for some reason I really loved Jim in this episode!
Overall, I would give it a B+ to A-. Classic office with a new twist. I like it and hope that the season continues this way.
I'm kind of divided on this one. It was an okay episode, but almost every single character got on my nerves (except Kelly, is it just me or are her tiny moments suddenly a lot funnier?!). I thought I was back on board with Pam after last week, and loved that she said she had the worst attitude in the office, but then that whole punching Michael thing made her obnoxious again. Michael was an ass and I can usually excuse him for anything. Dwight and Andy were ridiculous.
Yet despite that, it was well-paced, well-written and I can appreciate it as a fairly decent episode. Can't wait for the podcast!
Yet despite that, it was well-paced, well-written and I can appreciate it as a fairly decent episode. Can't wait for the podcast!
The plot with Michael wanting the Pam's mom to enjoy her cake, before breaking up with her, was taken right out of the original Heartbreak Kid. Charles Grodin, meets Cybil Shepherd on the beach in Florida while on his honeymoon. He decides he's made a big mistake, proceeds to tell his new bride during dinner but yells at the waiter because the pie isn't perfect.
Debi is re-watching Parks and Recreation. I'm re-watching older Office episodes in syndication. I'm still committed to the show but I'm not watching these episodes several times as I've done in the past. I feel Pam's character is flat because she has no reason to give her great "looks" to the camera anymore. There's no subtle plot for her (realizing Jim is dating Karen when they merge offices). Jim still has the occasion to look at the camera, and roll his eyes or look incredulous at something Michael has said. But Pam doesn't - all she can do is express rage at Michael's behavior. I think this leaves her character flat and un-fulfilling to us.
Debi is re-watching Parks and Recreation. I'm re-watching older Office episodes in syndication. I'm still committed to the show but I'm not watching these episodes several times as I've done in the past. I feel Pam's character is flat because she has no reason to give her great "looks" to the camera anymore. There's no subtle plot for her (realizing Jim is dating Karen when they merge offices). Jim still has the occasion to look at the camera, and roll his eyes or look incredulous at something Michael has said. But Pam doesn't - all she can do is express rage at Michael's behavior. I think this leaves her character flat and un-fulfilling to us.
I (respectfully) don't understand these anti-Pam comments. I thought she overreacted big time in "The Lover" but in this episode her actions are more than justified.
Michael was a grade A douche and deserved way more than what he got. Come on, Pam was even willing to give him a pass and then he makes the comment that her mom came on to him?
And the deleted scene (about Pam's mom big O, or lack thereof) was way funnier than anything they kept on the show.
On another note, I just watched "Parks and Recreation" on Hulu and, wow, they're really hitting it out of the park (no pun intended).
Michael was a grade A douche and deserved way more than what he got. Come on, Pam was even willing to give him a pass and then he makes the comment that her mom came on to him?
And the deleted scene (about Pam's mom big O, or lack thereof) was way funnier than anything they kept on the show.
On another note, I just watched "Parks and Recreation" on Hulu and, wow, they're really hitting it out of the park (no pun intended).
I really enjoyed this episode. I'm not sure who said Ryan has become the younger version of Creed but I agree. lol @ his "photography". was kelly topless in her photo?!? I thought Michael was an @ss when he broke up with Helene but then I thought about what he wants in life. He wants kids and someone he can have fun with. There is no need in wasting someone else's time if the relationship isn't going to go anywhere, especially at his age. You definitely need to let them eat their cake before you break it off though. The Dwight/Andy plot line was funny enough. I loved watching Toby give Pam tips while Michael watched in the background. I also loved Dwight questioning Michael's limp. Great episode.
Personally, I think the last act was what really made the episode worth it. All those years of Michael's (mis)management made almost everybody in the office want to hit him, (particularly Toby, which led to the funniest scene of the episode) and Pam got to live out their fantasies. It was finally balanced out with Jim & Pam's post-fight conversation:
Jim: "Feel better?"
Pam: "No, you were right."
By the way, did anyone else think there might have been a slight nod to 40-Year-Old Virgin, in which Steve's character gets to date the "hot grandmother"? Then, in this episode, he is weirded out by dating the soon-to-be hot grandmother.
Jim: "Feel better?"
Pam: "No, you were right."
By the way, did anyone else think there might have been a slight nod to 40-Year-Old Virgin, in which Steve's character gets to date the "hot grandmother"? Then, in this episode, he is weirded out by dating the soon-to-be hot grandmother.
Everyone is going to hate on Michael in this episode for dumping Pam's mom. While he does deserve the blame for being impulsive and thoughtless for doing so during lunch, on her birthday, in front of Jim and Pam, rather than in private, his reasons are valid.
It's not shallow to break up with someone because your future goals don't line up with theirs. The kid issue alone would be enough justification, knowing how important having his own kids is to Michael.
Perhaps those are things Michael should have considered before starting to date her, but she did come on to him first and they've only been together a month. There's nothing wrong with evaluating a relationship after the initial period of passion and discovering it's not what you want.
It's not shallow to break up with someone because your future goals don't line up with theirs. The kid issue alone would be enough justification, knowing how important having his own kids is to Michael.
Perhaps those are things Michael should have considered before starting to date her, but she did come on to him first and they've only been together a month. There's nothing wrong with evaluating a relationship after the initial period of passion and discovering it's not what you want.
posted by: Ink Asylum on Sat, 11/7 11:33 AM EST
I was barely awake through the first viewing (Parks and Rec has been hie-larious most of this season, but nearly did me in on Thursday), but on second viewing, it looks to me, from Pam's little smile and Jim's cat-and-Michael teasing, that the two of them are just getting back at/pranking Michael by making him squirm. I doubt Pam had any intention of actually punching the boss.
I haven't found Pam to be overly mean or unbelievable at all this season, just human. I don't need her to be my sweet, perfect girlfriend--I happily hand her over to Jim, big dumb lug though he is--so I'm glad to keep watching this new chapter in the Office.
Also liked the Dwight and Andy hijinks better the second viewing, as Dwight forgets the point of his ploy and gets swept away in outdoing Andy. No, not the best episode (I recently rewatched Michael, Dwight, and Ryan clubbing in NY in syndication, and that's a hard episode to top), but there were plenty of little moments: Creed and Toby FTW.
I haven't found Pam to be overly mean or unbelievable at all this season, just human. I don't need her to be my sweet, perfect girlfriend--I happily hand her over to Jim, big dumb lug though he is--so I'm glad to keep watching this new chapter in the Office.
Also liked the Dwight and Andy hijinks better the second viewing, as Dwight forgets the point of his ploy and gets swept away in outdoing Andy. No, not the best episode (I recently rewatched Michael, Dwight, and Ryan clubbing in NY in syndication, and that's a hard episode to top), but there were plenty of little moments: Creed and Toby FTW.
posted by: Outside Food on Sat, 11/7 01:49 PM EST
Ryan's photography seems to work better as a deleted scene. I love Pam and Jim's fake phone call to get out of lunch, Creeds talking head was a great capper. Dwights ploy was soo funny you forget what a bad idea it was until in the end it doesn't work. I don't think this is Dwight being too stupid, I think it's a lack of social skills due to growing up in an Amish/Nazi Beet Farming family. It was very funny but it did play like a webisode! I loved that Michael slowly realized what a bad idea it was dating a "GILF", while he was comming to terms with the idea that age might make a difference, at the same time Pam is realizing Michael is a good guy after all, it was sweet, sad, and funny all at the same time.
This is the second recent episode in which he referenced Holly, that plus Steve Carell has publically said he wants Amy Ryan back full time, I have a feeling Hollys branch will be closing soon.
This is the second recent episode in which he referenced Holly, that plus Steve Carell has publically said he wants Amy Ryan back full time, I have a feeling Hollys branch will be closing soon.
I hope Matt & Kevin stick with this season's over-arcing theme of "Jim needs to nut-up" for this episode. I can't believe Jim, supposedly the voice of reason, would just sit there and let Michael humiliate both Pam & Helene without even once trying to intervene.
I hope the lack of backbone is leading up to something further down the line because Halpert's becoming pretty lame this season.
I hope the lack of backbone is leading up to something further down the line because Halpert's becoming pretty lame this season.
I haven't had a chance to read the other comments so I hope I'm not repeating anyone. Well Matt, you got your favorite ending - the redeeming moment for Michael. This is what makes the Office such a great show. Just when you think you can't hate Michael any more, the writers humanize him. Nothing breaks my heart more than hearing Michael being wistful about the kids he wants. He had a good point about breaking up with Helene, but as usual with Michael, his timing sucks.
I love Pam. I think she needs to be a different Pam than earlier seasons. In earlier seasons, she was a receptionist with no goals and a no-good fiance. Everyone seemed to walk all over her. Now Pam is a saleswoman, married with a child on the way. Of course, she isn't the same girl. It is called growth. I for one applaud the new Pam. You go girl!
I love Pam. I think she needs to be a different Pam than earlier seasons. In earlier seasons, she was a receptionist with no goals and a no-good fiance. Everyone seemed to walk all over her. Now Pam is a saleswoman, married with a child on the way. Of course, she isn't the same girl. It is called growth. I for one applaud the new Pam. You go girl!
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